Visitors' civil comments encouraged.
President Obama. Try to find the strength and courage to be an American.
Change they can believe in.
The tribunals are "an enormous failure". So said his Oliness when he wanted their votes.
But now that the spys have convinced him that some of those prisoners are really mean men, he's decided to start up the tribunals once more but in a more palatable, more barackian style. And the o'bots will praise him for his pragmatism, even though this goes against everything we as a people stand for.
I'm not going to quote the BBC I just read or all the human rights groups who are stunned. You all are smart enough to find that stuff yourselves. I am going to say that I expected this and much more to come. Barack Obama has no moral center but worse, he doesn't have the strength it takes to be an American leader.
Throughout history, leaders have taken the easy way out. Someone they trust says somebody else is bad, throw 'em in the dungeon and forget about them. Believing, trusting and fighting for the rights our founders died for. That takes strength and courage. Things President Obama lacks.
We made it through 200 years by not jailing people based on suspicion alone. But the norm in the press now is that phrase I hate, the phrase that sums up what the Bushies did to my country. "Suspected Terrorist".
I suspect that Dick Cheney is a Terrorist. Really. He infiltrated our government under the cover of fraud elections so that he could undermine the inconvenient Constitution. He then tortured and sometimes killed people, invaded whole countries and had his soldiers kill hundreds of thousands. I suspect he is a Terrorist. His God is named Oil but he's a Terrorist none the less.
It has to be real hard to know a man is truly evil. That the man you hold in jail will most likely go back to Yemen or Saudi Arabia to kill once more. I understand. I also understand that many of those men are also fools caught in a whirlwind of peer pressure or just caught in the wrong place looking the wrong way. It doesn't matter. What matters is America. Not the place. America the Idea.
Give me Liberty or Give me Death.
President Obama. Try to find the strength and courage to be an American.
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The "will we or won't we, do we or don't we" topic about torture isn't about them. It has never been about them. It is about "us". Will we allow what "they" did to make "us" do things we know are wrong and then justify them? The answer seems to be a resounding "yes".
I think that Dick Cheney is the most dangerous kind of an evil man. An evil man that actually believes that what he is doing, what he did, and what he encouraged to be done, was the right thing, the best thing, to protect this country. I believe he believes that so much he would do or say anything. He is also power hungry but since that describes most of the asshats we send to Washington D.C. how can we fault him unless we fault all the others?
Obama was and is nothing more than a run-of-the-mill, garden-variety politician. He will lie, spin, flip-flop and parse words just like any other run-of-the-mill, garden-variety politician.
The problem was never with him, it was with the fools that rushed to support him as if he was something special and different. Like the Bushbots before them the Obots now are trying to justify their faith in their man. Getting harder by the day and the days aren't that many since he planted his phony ass in the Oval.
Those of us that weren't fooled by Chicago Slim unfortunately have to live in the same country, ruled by him and his thugs, as those who were stupid enough to vote him into office. And I have to say, I'm more than a little angry about that.
A Dishonest/Biased Media Is A Crime Against Democracy!
I logged on to dKos yesterday to read the outrage. Crickets. But there IS progress. I asked where the outrage was, fully expecting to be flamed. I wasn't. After clammyc got over the idea that I'd hijacked his torture diary by mentioning Guantanamo he was fairly civil. What struck me was that I got not one negative rating for comments that did not support their messiah. In the past there would have been eight or ten.
They may not be willing to trash him yet but they're not happy, either. What fun!
GONE FISHING
I haven't gone over there in ages (can't stand the little twits). Glad to hear, they are not happy; I hope the weight of their fiasco weighs them down.
The military tribunals cave marks the first serious disappointment I have in Barack Obama's presidency. What before I was able to assign to pragmatism, I cannot with this decision. Unlike the decision not to prosecute Bush officials (a matter of political reality), or the decision not to release the latest torture photos (a genuinely tough call regarding the possibility of troop endangerment), this decision on the tribunals marks the first clear-cut, pro-active, independently authored continuation of an odious, authoritarian Bush policy. I am deeply disappointed in the person I voted for today.
What is so puzzling about the decision is the political calculus--if there even is one. Obama's strongest supporters up until the last couple months have been the civil libertarian left. Keith Olberman, anyone? Why he finds it so easy to toss their concerns aside, I don't know. I know many folks here will attribute it to your assumption that Barack Obama will toss anyone aside in the name of accumulating greater political power, but that attitude just proves my point: what political power is gained by pissing off your most loyal supporters over and over again?
I still hold out great excitement for the domestic policy achievements that are forthcoming. I know many folks at Partizane think that Barack Obama will flip-flop on those too, but for the sake of our country, I hope you're wrong on that score.
And before anyone flames me for being late to the party on criticizing Obama, please pause for a second and remember that this post was not easy for me to write, and that it was written out of sorrow for the civil libertarian failures of this administration, not so that I can "get on the bandwagon", or "climb under the bus". I am just trying to be honest here.
Thanks for your honesty and proving me right in my assessment of you as an honest person and valuable member of our community. Partizane is meant to never be an echo chamber.
Thanks for being here Layla.
Civil Discourse - ERA - A Mother President - Women's Rights - Primary Reform
That is about the best response I could imagine during a difficult time.
Some of the things you listed here
http://www.partizane.com/node/1000#comment-10175
are still valid.
It's a shame about the torture and prisons thingies not working out the way you had hoped. Signing Ledbetter was nice, though it would've been nicer if he'd put money in his budget to enforce it. Same with ending the global gag rule. As for "universal health care", as you put it, Obama's not using that term. It's "health care reform" and it's being shaped by the big insurance companies who have the most to gain.
That leaves us with the three women--Solis, Johnson and Sebelius. Three out of eight isn't much to brag about, especially when you consider that they should have been lumped together as evidence of his "support" of women. I hope they like working with Larry Summers.
I appreciate your willingness to acknowledge your disappointment in Obama's approach to torture and civil liberties. It is my fervent wish that you not experience any more discouraging decisions by the president. But I'm not betting on it.
GONE FISHING
I do not support Hilda Solis as marvelous and I most definately do not support EFCA!
I don't support Kathleen Sebilious either.
A Dishonest/Biased Media Is A Crime Against Democracy!
I appreciate you keeping it real with me, and keeping this debate sincere by accepting me for who I am and what I believe.
Thanks go to you in return for keeping the debate civil. I cannot imagine why any blog would ban you. But then having been there, done that and gotten the t-shirt, it shouldn't surprise me.
Nothing...and I mean nothing...could make me happier than to be wrong about the president. I am not selfish enough to wish for the country's failure to vindicate my own opinion. I just don't see any evidence beyond a few token actions that we are making true progress. What I do see is an unnerving continuation of too many of George W. Bush's policies. From FISA to DADT to Gitmo to bailing out billionaires this administration is beginning to look eerily familiar.
GONE FISHING
It is my personal belief that MSNBC backs Obama for the same reason it backed Bush and the Iraq War early on. What could that be? Simple, money for General Electric, a multinational company that has no homeland and no moral compass.
GE cashed in on the War (continues to do so), and it hopes to cash in on Obama's green proposals. Olbermann, Matthews, and Ole Rachel are not journalists and are simply there to make America safe for GE . Sad to see once decent people sell themselves so easily, but that is what happened with them.
Think about it, MSNBC is tanking in the ratings but it keeps on with the same programming; why is that? Simple, to make GE happy. Who knows, maybe GE can make Olbermann POTUS one day; it was able to make it happen for former spokesperson, Ronald Reagan,
You are asking a lot of a person who lives only to be worshipped. There never was any character shown by him. So much about him was concealed that in itself should have been a tip off. He wrote his own history and serves his masters well.
but can't think of a thing to add. twandx, you said it well.
GONE FISHING
I grew-up with the belief that you should do what is right, even if it is unpopular or causes you personal suffering. I’ve learned, the hard way, that a great many people don’t subscribe to my belief. They do what is easiest for them or whatever benefits them the most. Obama is one of those people. The only thing he considers when making a decision is if it will benefit him personally or politically. He is an opportunist. He lacks the conviction and character to do the things that a President has to do in order to propagate the ideals and beliefs that our country was founded on. I doubt I will ever change this opinion of him. There is just too much water under the bridge now.
If any useful information was gained by torture, then I think it was a fluke, because it is common knowledge that someone will say anything to get you to stop inflicting pain on them. Perhaps showing the detainees that we are a good and decent people with morals and respect for others, would have convinced them that we aren’t the devil, which they are taught to believe. This could have allowed the interrogators to gain useful and reliable information through more humane methods.
I believe that Obama thinks of himself as a citizen of the world, not as an American. I don’t think he gives a tinker’s damn about this country or appreciates what it really means to be an American. I can never see him sacrificing anything for this country.